Wrong Error report in JOSM's Validation (?)

Question

Hi, I'm a user of JOSM, not a develloper. I have ask similar questions in the Dutch user forum, but only got replies like : "Yep, the validation in JOSM might not be optimal"

I'm a user and editor of the recreational cycle network in The Netherlands and it can cost me considerable time to figure out what's wrong with network relations. Especially so when infact the error report is the only thing that's wrong :(

Here is one of many examples :

network=rcn note=23-62 route=bicycle type=route Relation ID=1263377

JOSM 7000 Validation : Role forward unknown Role backward unknown

http://ra.osmsurround.org/

Great! This relation seems ok. This relation can be connected as one piece.

Rating The relation analyzer (RA) tries to assemble the relation data to see if it is in one piece (either a line with just two ends, or Y-shaped, or more complicated). The pieces are assembled using rules which include looking at roles such as "forward" and "backward". If a relation cannot be connected into one single piece, the RA will create more than one.

Can someone enlight me please ?

Gys

Answer 1

5

It's a bug in the JOSM validator, I think. For item name="Bicycle route" "data/defaultpresets.xml" contains:

        <roles>
            <role key="" text="route segment" requisite="required" type="way"/>
        </roles>

whereas for item name="Piste route" it contains:

        <roles>
           <role key="" text="route segment" requisite="optional" type="way" />
            <role key="forward" text="forward segment" requisite="optional" type="way" />
            <role key="backward" text="backward segment" requisite="optional" type="way" />
            <role key="link" text="link segment" requisite="optional" type="way" />
            <role key="shortcut" text="shortcut segment" requisite="optional" type="way" />
            <role key="variant" text="variant segment" requisite="optional" type="way" />
            <role key="start" text="entry points" requisite="optional" type="node" />
        </roles>

I can see no logical reason why a bicycle route way can't be oneway.

A similar symptom was reported here (although that looks like it wasn't actually a bug as such - it was due to a confusion of the "new" and "old" public transport schemas).

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answered 07 May '14, 03:16

SomeoneElse ♦
36.9k●71●370●866
accept rate: 16%

Thanks Andy, Imo you traced down the error in JOSM's validator. This will be most helpful for The Netherlands. We have a very dense cycle network which is becomming almost impossible to maintain because about 30% of the routes are polluted with JOSM validator errors. I will post a link on the forum here : http://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewforum.php?id=12

Thanks again Gys

(07 May '14, 07:59) Gys de Jongh

4

JOSM developers are very unlikely to notice complaints on the Dutch forum and only slightly more likely to notice problems reported here. So I create a bug report for this issue: http://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/9992

(07 May '14, 11:21) cartinus

1

Gys, for maintaining the cycle and walking networks in Belgium and The Netherlands, you're better off with e.g. http://osma.vmarc.be/ which has specialized tests and knowledge about those type of networks.

(07 May '14, 12:34) escada

Thanks escada, I find myself frequently looking at this : http://osma.vmarc.be/en/network/1061480 because it's in my back yard. Note the frustrating numbers of "Errors" I would like to get rid of all of them :(

(07 May '14, 20:32) Gys de Jongh

1

@cartinus thanks a lot ! I don't know what you did, but to me it sounds like exactly what I would have liked to do : wake up the programmers to improver their error checking in JOSM :)

Thanks again Gys

(07 May '14, 20:42) Gys de Jongh

Answer 2

0

In general, JOSM's validator is just a tool like many others which might help you to spot problems in the data. It may have false positives. JOSM's validator has different issue classes (error, warning, info) which show you the severity of the shown issue and – IMHO – correlate with false positive error rate. Such tools are never 100 % right.

Regarding the validator's warning about relation member roles also see the similar (core) problem what-does-the-warning-role-reverse-unknown-role-verification-problem-mean-in-josm.

If you feel that a false positive is a programming error (e.g. a systematic false positive which occurs very often which was not shown in the older versions) or if there are many false positives which could be easily avoided, please report to the programmers of JOSM (bug tracker, see first link).

Also see my comment above for other discussion places.

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answered 07 May '14, 01:37

aseerel4c26 ♦
32.6k●18●248●554
accept rate: 18%

edited 07 May '14, 02:03

@aseerel4c26: If a tool bites you it's a bug and as I told you 1) I'm not a programmer of JOSM just a user 2)I posted this on several fora already

(07 May '14, 07:53) Gys de Jongh

@Gys de Jongh: Sure, I read that you are no programmer but I told you how to report it to the programmers. Programmers depend on feedback and bugreports of the users. It seems you missed this. In the meantime, Cartinus has reported it there (see his comment above).

(07 May '14, 13:45) aseerel4c26 ♦

@aseerel4c26 Can you please fire your other brain cell ? What do you think I'm doing ? I started this thread by saying that I'm not a programmer and want to provide feedback to the guys who devellop JOSM and posted this at the appropriate sites.

(07 May '14, 20:36) Gys de Jongh

@Gys de Jongh: unbelievable, I hope someone soon deletes your comment (this one then too, of course).

(07 May '14, 20:54) aseerel4c26 ♦

Wrong Error report in JOSM's Validation (?)

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